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Offline Levanime  
#1 Posted : 27 August 2018 20:49:44(UTC)
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Hi Guys,

Business is getting tough for everyone here as almost everyday we learn there are new competitors with cheap chinese tools that cover 70-80% of our day jobs, lets say mini acdp.

So in this environment some of us bought hw4 for having full functionality, including bdms, cas4, etc. It's been almost year (if I'm not wrong) and we still don't see promised stuff. Instead we see new tool offered which again should cost us money, and there will be cheaper version with most of functionality that will again be beneficial for new competitors.

In this tough situation, I believe we deserve to have more information, what will be functionality of new tool, What will be price, what are the plans for the future, because I know many guys are planing to ditch this stuff as (again) business is getting hard because of lots of competitors who get their stuff for really cheap and push prices down.

Almost all of us were before choice to go with AH2 or BMWExplorer and we all chose AH2 because it was cheaper. Same thing is happening now for new guys who has much cheaper options that cover most of the functionality thats in demand.

Thank you in advance!
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Offline GpMotorworks  
#2 Posted : 27 August 2018 20:57:47(UTC)
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Well said levanime, I had this discussion with support this morning.
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Offline Tombo  
#3 Posted : 27 August 2018 20:59:47(UTC)
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I think exactly the same and I'm one of them who bought different tool needed to do cas4
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Offline BMWorkshop  
#4 Posted : 27 August 2018 21:08:53(UTC)
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Unfortunately I should agree with you. When I was buying this tool I thought it was complete BMW tool that can do everything and you do not need anything else. I quickly learnt that that was not the case and still not unfortunately.
Coding function really only works well on E series BMW. No support for BMW without CAS. F series coding is useless. Programming function for NBT or Cluster is not possible. The information on how use the tool is very limited and no training manuals. We need to search for wiring diagrams on competitors sites.
I am very unhappy with the tool.
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Offline cardiagcom  
#5 Posted : 27 August 2018 21:13:13(UTC)
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I think exactly the same, no any exactly info from Autohex , period from last update very long, nothing more nothing less
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Offline Natem3  
#6 Posted : 27 August 2018 21:19:18(UTC)
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I have also bought a lot of other tools in the past few months to help with my needs of keys, CAS3 repair that have failed from downgrade. Have been getting a lot of older BMW DMEs in and again needed other software. Was hoping BDM would be out sooner so I didn’t need to purchase 10 other tools. Was a very good selling point when I was looking at purchasing hardware fo was hoping BDM would be out sooner so I didn’t need to purchase 10 other pools. Was a very good selling point when I was looking at purchasing hardware 4 as a complete Solution with BDM function. I would like more information on this new tool also.
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Offline cardiagcom  
#7 Posted : 27 August 2018 21:22:35(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Natem3 Go to Quoted Post
I have also bought a lot of other tools in the past few months to help with my needs of keys, CAS3 repair that have failed from downgrade. Have been getting a lot of older BMW DMEs in and again needed other software. Was hoping BDM would be out sooner so I didn’t need to purchase 10 other tools. Was a very good selling point when I was looking at purchasing hardware fo was hoping BDM would be out sooner so I didn’t need to purchase 10 other pools. Was a very good selling point when I was looking at purchasing hardware 4 as a complete Solution with BDM function. I would like more information on this new tool also.

How you think we need to pay again extra money for BDM ?? Autohex say totally diffrend long time ago.
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Offline BMWorkshop  
#8 Posted : 27 August 2018 21:25:31(UTC)
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We paid for HW4 and what did we get from it? Everything what it does could be done with HW3!
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Offline cardiagcom  
#9 Posted : 27 August 2018 21:38:45(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: BMWorkshop Go to Quoted Post
We paid for HW4 and what did we get from it? Everything what it does could be done with HW3!


Exactly
Offline julienjj  
#10 Posted : 27 August 2018 21:47:35(UTC)
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I want a wiki with all the diagrams and instructions :)
it's not nice to try a job for the first time and being in the fog a bit about how it will go.
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Offline AUTOHEX_BMW  
#11 Posted : 27 August 2018 23:22:12(UTC)
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Hw 4 is still under developer. They sell it earlier because couple of tools have take out solution for fem. AH is a very good tool, but price and subscription is a little bit expensive compare to another tools for bmw. Updates are rare, many functions that other tools make obd, AH do by boot mode,there are missing some bmw functions that other tools do...... And many other which does not justify the annual subscription of 750usd
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Offline rbauto  
#12 Posted : 27 August 2018 23:24:07(UTC)
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I am upset as well.

I feel that we got misled by hardware 4. The promise of cas4 reading is pretty big. I’ve had to buy other tools as well.

I personally think that the new hardware should be heavily discounted for hardware 4 owners.

The lack of Cas4 decryption is a huge deal. Other tools can decrypt cas4 and they don’t cost anywhere near what ah cost.

More clarity with customers would go a long way. I’d like it if they locked down this forum to ah owners only via serial number registration. That way everything can be discussed openly. We won’t have to worry about outsiders looking at diagrams or other info. This way we can have better dialogue.
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User is suspended until 19/10/2019 02:54:59(UTC) Crazy  
#13 Posted : 28 August 2018 04:15:53(UTC)
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Unfortunately people blindly believe in good advertisement and don’t use their brains at all. What’s for annual payment 700$ ? Explorer does not have any payments , all functions are offline , except reading isn from 6hp. So what is chipper god damn? Want sell my HD4, but nobody wants to buy it, people get smarter nowadays. 5k $ spent in cats ass .
Offline rbauto  
#14 Posted : 28 August 2018 06:41:09(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Crazy Go to Quoted Post
Unfortunately people blindly believe in good advertisement and don’t use their brains at all. What’s for annual payment 700$ ? Explorer does not have any payments , all functions are offline , except reading isn from 6hp. So what is chipper god damn? Want sell my HD4, but nobody wants to buy it, people get smarter nowadays. 5k $ spent in cats ass .


I know this is Temsky740 from mhh. I can tell from the writing.

Stop obsessing over autohex and get a life. It’s pretty sad that you don’t have anything better to do but make profiles on this forum and be a baby.

There’s more to life than cars and tools. Go out there and enjoy life. Who cares about what the competitor is doing.
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Offline Autohex_II_BMW  
#15 Posted : 28 August 2018 10:51:01(UTC)
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Hi Guys
There is one thing right in your posts. It is about the BDM functions in HW4, I will tell you the story about this.
We started the HW4 project on 11/2016, the plan included the BDM functions, we made about 5-6 prototypes during 8 months, everything was fine in the final prototype which was pre-final (CAS1 to CAS4+ all were OK). After we made the final product (PCB version 3.21) we found an instability in BDM function (CAS4+) due to the noise from other signals. People who have PCB version 3.21 can open the device and they will find an IC: CY22393 which is responsible of generating high frequency to unlock the MCU. We could not do anything other than disabling this function in the hardware and restudy the price to be reasonable for our customers. We tried to fix this issue by software later, it did not work because of the complication of PCB, so software wont help to isolate the noise from the signal. Later production (PCB version 3.22) we removed the CY22393 totally from design and we decided to make a dedicated hardware mainly for BDM job, so we can control the signal noise.
Now, if you note during this year for customers who have HW4 many new functions came up and for free. FEM/BDC is free of charges, MSD85/MSV90 is also free, you have more stable programming with HW4, and we will not stop at this point.
The new hardware which will come up (HexTag) it will have the BDM functions and ability to upgrade to do tuning job (and clone Ecus), and we promise you all, it will be impressive, the price for HW4 customers will be almost same production cost, it should be available in 30-45 days max.



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Offline Admin  
#16 Posted : 28 August 2018 11:53:11(UTC)
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Hi Levanime,
I think you know more than others about our support. If I am not wrong, you had an issue with your HW4 delivery, we activated your HW3 back. Later we sent you your HW4 again and I think it was free of charges.
We are dealing with our customers as partners, we care to their business and consider their success is ours. It is pity to compare Autohex II with Chinese tools. Watching videos on YouTube is not enough to know about these tools.
If the price was the reason to buy Autohex, I would say you were very lucky to not buy other tool. Please just compare the functions list of Autohex II to other tools, compare the performance, the bug count, the ease of use, the support behind every function, forget about price.

Hi BMWWorkshop.
Are you sure there is a tool can do coding/programming without FA from CAS or ZGW? This is the first time I hear Autohex II has issues in coding F series. Please be reasonable in your post, Attacking our tool this way is hurting.

Hi AUTOHEX_BMW
The annual fees for all packages other than AHX0004,AHX0005 is 350$ this includes the software update, extended hardware warranty, extended technical support. The remaining 400$ is the for the online programming.

And finally thanks to RbAuto for his sharp note, this guy even does not have an Autohex.

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Offline AUTOHEX_BMW  
#17 Posted : 28 August 2018 14:30:47(UTC)
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I have full package.
I have no way to pay just 350 usd since I bought the whole range of services from you. And without online I can not make keys to cas3 +, fem etc. ..... Restrict me a service that I paid the first time since I bought AH

Edited by user 28 August 2018 14:43:52(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Offline Levanime  
#18 Posted : 28 August 2018 22:54:34(UTC)
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Hi Guys,

First of all thank you for fast reply,
I want to clarify few things that I see were misunderstood.

1) I did not intent this thread to be somehow turned into Microtronik critic discussion, I wanted more clarification about product and pricing.

2) No one is questioning Microtronik Support quality, which is (by my information ) the best among competitors. We appreciate it, although we are paying money for it too.
I also appreciate your help activating my HW3 when I was in tough situation that resolved it.
Although, let me remind you that at that point, before initially sending me HW4, my existing HW3 was disabled without my confirmation, which caused all the problem.
In no means I was going to go back to those topics, again I enjoy Microtronik support and I'm thankful for it.

3) I really would enjoy having this forum closed with more info here. Temskys posts are always funny.

4) Little Wiki would be very, very helpful. for example I need to do F10 6HP now for first time, and I'm having really hard time finding instructions, what I need whatnot.
Of course I can ask support, but because of time difference it would take lots of time to get reply, plus, in this case I would just read Wiki and that would be it, I would bother support just for problems, not for instructions.

5) Now, regarding chinese tools. In no means I compared them to AH2, you can not find it in my post. What I wrote was explaining toughness of business because of Chinese tools. Every left and right guys are buying them for $500 and taking big part of our jobs with super cheap prices.

6) As long as we are all here, I will write it, please consider adding decrypting CAS4+ dump with key. Cas4 editor in general would be great idea.
We have cases when we need it and we have to bother our friends with VVDI2.

7) And finally, personally I would rather pay money for functionality than having them for free, In case if it would drive Microtronik to be more innovative.

Once again, thank you for your support, this topic was not meant to be confronting, was just asking for more details about what is going on, as we paid money for hw4 and we did not get functionality and now we see new tool which we again need to buy.
Technical problems arised makes perfect sense to us and only thing left is the price that will be offered to hw4 owners.

have a great day.
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Offline Tibibond  
#19 Posted : 28 August 2018 23:20:31(UTC)
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I relate perfectly with levan, but for me point 6 is the most fustrating because other cheap tools can do it, acdp and vvdi 2 can make key on cas4+ without isn if you have working key, and vvdi has dump editor for all cas 4 versions, including encrypted version....

Edited by user 28 August 2018 23:30:53(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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Offline BMWorkshop  
#20 Posted : 28 August 2018 23:51:50(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Admin Go to Quoted Post
Hi Levanime,
I think you know more than others about our support. If I am not wrong, you had an issue with your HW4 delivery, we activated your HW3 back. Later we sent you your HW4 again and I think it was free of charges.
We are dealing with our customers as partners, we care to their business and consider their success is ours. It is pity to compare Autohex II with Chinese tools. Watching videos on YouTube is not enough to know about these tools.
If the price was the reason to buy Autohex, I would say you were very lucky to not buy other tool. Please just compare the functions list of Autohex II to other tools, compare the performance, the bug count, the ease of use, the support behind every function, forget about price.

Hi BMWWorkshop.
Are you sure there is a tool can do coding/programming without FA from CAS or ZGW? This is the first time I hear Autohex II has issues in coding F series. Please be reasonable in your post, Attacking our tool this way is hurting.

Hi AUTOHEX_BMW
The annual fees for all packages other than AHX0004,AHX0005 is 350$ this includes the software update, extended hardware warranty, extended technical support. The remaining 400$ is the for the online programming.

And finally thanks to RbAuto for his sharp note, this guy even does not have an Autohex.


Dear Admin,
I appreciate your reply, and the question. First of all it is stated on your website that:
quote
Autohex II BMW Full PackageProduct Code: AHX0005 Siutable for: BMW Technicians who are looking for a tool that can do everything possible in BMW cars.

You never stated that it is not possible to do coding/programming in e46, e53, e39 and there are still quite few there that when you read your statement you would think you can do them.

In relation to coding in F series. After buying the AH I had to wait almost a year before F series coding function was added to it even though the tool was advertised as "the only tool need in a BMW garage". Ok now it is added but if you go to manual coding you can search for the needed parameter for ages as there is no search in it. Can "werte" figure be changed in Autohex? It was not possible when last I tried it for coding. I had to get esys and had to learn how to do coding in it.
I appreciate that my comments could sound a bit rough, but you should understand me too.
I paid almost 6k for the Full package, then next year subscription, then while installing AH software on windows 10 laptop and then updating it the software crashed and killed my HW3, Then I had to order and pay for HW4 hoping to get promised functionalities and what did I get? nothing that was promised again. In addition I killed customers cluster after trying to program it with HW4. Now I am afraid to use AH for programming.
I really hope that AH will work as I have invested enough in it already. The explanation about HW4 we have received only now! Why you did not tell us this before?
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